miko wrote:Catoprion mento and Pygopristis denticulata are not piranhas.
Although people give them the common names of Wimple piranhas and Lobetoothed piranhas they are not the real McCoy.
The only 3 genera cataloged as “real” Piranhas are Pygocentrus, Pristobrycon and Serrasalmus.
I want to clear up some misconceptions and errors in replies to this thread.
Ivan is correct in summation that wimpel (correct spelling) piranha (Catoprion) and the lobetoothed piranha (Pygopristis denticulata) are not 'real McCoy'.
Regarding Antonio's remarks, this is where it gets dicey. Science doesn't use common name except marginally when it comes to species. In otherwords, when the common name is used in description to a scientific name. In case, majority of the genera is loosely called piranha. Often overlooked is the Myers (1972) definition of "piranha" and "caribe". Myers limited the name to the most dangerous piranhas. Namely Pygocentrus. This definition is used mostly in laws and statutes. Not necessarily science. Though one could argue why it should also be used in science as well.
At OPEFE, I chose to use Myers definition because it makes more sense. Native, local people are the ones that use common names most frequently. As Myers stated, when you try to pin down the fisherman on what kind of piranha it is, they will either say a verdadero (meaning TRUE) or give it another localized name if its one of the other ones that are thought to be more harmless.
Ivan is most familiar with Venezuelan caribes because he lives in Venezuela and fishes for them along with George Fear.
As for combi remarks: So what Machado is referring to, is not really the names attributed by locals, but the piranha "clade". That exists (till now) out of Serrasalmus, Pygocentrus and (partly) Pristobrycon. There are two problems rising with this. Fist of all the extincted Megapiranha paranensis. Look at the clades and you'll see the problem : excluding C.mento and P.denticulata, means also excluding M.paranensis.
He's looking at this entirely wrong and a narrow focus. In order to understand Dr. Machado-Allison, you have to understand where science is coming from. Megapiranha is simply a partial jaw. Not much to go on. It could be an extinct piranha or just another pacu that has piranha-like teeth. Like those found in Tometes, etc. We don't know. As for the term Piranha Clade, it means just that. An association with "true piranhas" ie., piranha clade and those that are not in terms of DNA. Doesn't mean DNA proves they are a "TRUE" piranha by the Myers definition, but certainly does help understand more what piranhas are.